Real Time with Bill Maher (August 3, 2018) – Full Transcript

Counterterrorism expert Malcolm Nance and historian Nancy MacLean are the interview guests. The panelists are political analyst Kristen Soltis Anderson, columnist Charles Blow and political analyst Steve Schmidt.

Speaker start the clock. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ [Cheers and applause]

Bill Maher: Thank you very much. All right, thank you! All right, thank you! [Cheers and applause] thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen! That’s enough of that, I tell you. [Laughs] I love you. Thank you. Please, I know, I am fair please, I know, I am fair clumped. Clumped. I know. I know. I am so glad you are in a good mood because I’m in a good mood. I’m in a good mood. Why? I am wearing ostrich underwear. [Laughs] oh, it’s the best, the ostrich, I tell you. We’ve been on vacation — I can always tell when it’s time to come back from my vacation because the state is on fire. That seems to me — [laughs] you know, it is 95 days until the election. So clear your calendar. [Applause] And the voting systems are more insecure than the president. Now our president has always been unhinged, and I have to say, in the last month, he did not get more hinged. Did you see, this week, he held two of his hillbilly Nuremberg rallies. [Cheers and applause]

It’s scary to people in this profession. He calls the media “the enemy of the people,” except, of course, for Fox News. They are so far up his ass as they are the enema of the people. From now on, collusion not a crime, but journalism apparently is. We live in a country now where reporting reality gets attacked because it threatens the fantasy world created by the cult leader. So it was kind of good to see a couple of days ago all of our top security people, head of the FBI, the director of national intelligence, all those dudes were out there saying, “it was Russia, its rationale, it’s happening again, it’s not a drill, now if we can just get the commander-in-chief on the same page”, because when Trump says no collusion, he means with his own national security team. [Applause] I mean, how can these people expect to do their job when the president himself is tweeting, as he did a couple of days ago, that the attorney general [Imitating Trump] “is to stop this rigged witch hunt with Russia?” What happened to, “I can’t comment on an ongoing investigation?” Remember those days? [Applause] And if you are so innocent, why do we have to stop the investigation? It’s a little suspicious. It’s like when you come home and the first thing the kids says is “the babysitter is a liar!” How would I know that? Don’t think that deeply into it.

Anyway, but look, all praise to president Trump, we have to get the good news, too, unemployment is at an 18 year low. However, I were real, biggest true economic problem is income inequality. And that is not getting better. Still, no reason for what happened this week, someone cut one of Betsy DeVos‘ yachts loose. [laughs] It’s true. But it’s okay, she has ten. Yes, now comes the real challenge for Betsy DeVos, subtraction.

Oh, but you know who is apparently going broke? This was a shocking. The NRA. Did you see this? [cheers and applause] A recent court filing was made public and they are in such grave financial trouble, they said they have already lost all their insurance coverage, and they soon may be unable to exist. [cheers and applause] Really, I feel bad for them. They say the only thing they own of real value is Congress.

But you know who apparently is living very well? This guy, Paul Manafort. Have you seen the trial? he was Trump campaign manager and he is on trial now, and apparently he’s living very well, $18,000 karaoke Machine, cashmere jeans. Do you have the cashmere? Cashmere — [laughs] and the ostrich jacket worth $15,000. He pled not guilty by reason of MC Hammer. It’s an interesting defense. [laughs] This dude, and five years, he spent a million dollars just on suits. Has this motherfucker heard of cocaine?

But listen, we are in California. California — Okay, well, we don’t have to gloat. But we are the leader of the resistance. We do get a lot of shit, people — fuck them,  because we are the leader of the resistance! Yes! [cheers and applause] Leader of the resistance. Also, something we did a long time ago, mileage standards for cars because we are so big, we raised mileage standards and the automakers, they all — they were forced to make their cars in line because you can’t not sell cars in a state with 40 million people. So, naturally, Trump now is trying to get rid of the standards for cars. And he says, it will save lives. I could not make this up. He said — listen to the logic, if your car gets bad mileage, you’ll drive less and have less of a chance to get into an accident. Yes, Trump is claiming he is doing this for safety reasons. Always the number one concern of the man who fucks porn stars without a condom. And he says, don’t think of it as smog, think of it as a permanent Instagram filter.

Okay, the last thing that I must report to you — I don’t want to, but this happened this weekend it was kind of a big story. I learned a new word. I didn’t want to. But that word is QAnon. Because we saw this other Trump rally. All the people — not all of them — but there they are, q, “We are with q, we are all q.” At first I thought, republicans have finally come to terms with their sexuality. But no, no. this is a big movement on the right. see, we don’t hear about this Because we are not crazy. Q is a person, a member of the “deep state,” way high up in the deep state, and now he’s turning on them, and he’s revealing at the is run by a giant pedophile ring. Really, every president since Reagan has been part of it, Hillary, Obama, you know who is a pedophile? Tom Hanks. Steven Spielberg. And who is gonna stop this? Trump. Trump. Because who is more qualified to stop pedophilia than a creep who used to walk in on miss teen USA pageant? [applause] He wasn’t being a creep! He was looking for pedophiles! He is the Serpico of child molesters! Trump love those girls like they were his own daughter.

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We have a great show. We have Charles Blow, Kristen Salter Sanderson, and a little later, we are speaking to author and history Professor Nancy MacLean. But first up, he was a counterterrorism intelligence, the author of a new book “The Plot to Destroy Democracy: How Putin’s Cyberspies Are Undermining America and Dismantling the West,” a great patriot, Malcolm Nance. There he is! Hello to you, sir. Patriotism. So much more than eyes. How are you, Malcolm? You always go to smile on your face. I don’t know how you do it. I need sedatives. Do you have any?

[Malcolm laughs]

Bill: Okay, I want to talk about the election, the monologue, you saw they are into Facebook again. Can they be stopped? Do you think Russia can be stopped as we are presently constituted?

Malcolm: Yes. Russia can be stopped. you have to understand Something. there are a lot of safeguards built into the constitution. what the Russians have been doing are, they figured out that there are few things within our system of government, that they can exploit. the first one was freedom of speech. Freedom of the press. Right? when they do that, then they can go after other components of it, like right to assembly. but first they have to actually destroy the fundamental underpinnings of American democracy. and the way you do that as you elect a president. And they elected a president. So can we stop that? What can we do? what the founding fathers in the constitution wrote, which is, right to assemble. to mobilize and wipe away electorally the people who have undermined our democracy.

Bill: Well, I hope that is true, except that they got that rigged, too. I mean —

Malcolm: You can only read so much.

Bill: In the last 16 years, two of the presidents have not one like the popular vote. so we talk about how the republicans’ days are numbered because they are getting older but it doesn’t matter if they Have the whole thing rigged. with gerrymandering and voter suppression and the Koch brothers and all the money and all of that —

Malcolm: I think their biggest thing that they have rigged if they have rigged apathy. they have managed to get 50% of the electric to not even come out.

Bill: But what about the actual hacking? there was a hacker convention this weekend in Vegas. That must be a great party.

Malcolm: [laughs] With Stormy Daniels there?

Bill: No. We’ll get a Stormy Daniels in a minute. But somebody hacked into the voting booth in 90 minutes. I think last year, a 16-year-old got in there in 45 minutes, and made the voting booth play a song.

Malcolm: They rick rolled it.

Bill: It’s a voting booth. You turn the voting booth into a jukebox in 45 minutes by a 16-year-old? You are telling me we can’t stop Russia?

Malcolm: I used to work at NSA, we can do anything.

Bill: Oh, boy.

Malcolm: You have to understand the underlying attack strategy. the American electoral system is made up of a lot of diverse systems, whether you are talking about computers, electronic voting, but a lot of it is no paper ballots, mail in ballots. You can’t hack those. You can try to stuff ballot boxes, that is very hard to do. The place, though, if the Russians are going to attack them and they are not going to attack those machines. They are going to attack the simple laptop or desktop that is sitting at a state registrar’s office that tallies up all the numbers that come in from those disparate voting systems. That could be one or two small computers. They used to do it on chalkboards, actually, back in the ’60s. They would do it on chalkboards and they would write down and do the math right in front of people. That is vulnerable. If I were going to do target hearing, I was going to choose what to do in a national election, I would go back to the computer, and that I would make it change numbers right before everyone’s face. So that you would know that it’s happened and throw chaos into the system. But the only way to make sure that that doesn’t happen is you’ve got to vote, and that is where our biggest problem is.

Bill: I think that’s going to change. I think people are going to vote. So you worked for the NSA, you said, and other agencies. We don’t want to get to into your past —

Malcolm: Whatever.

Bill: you know me, I was never one of those liberals who who shit on the intelligence Agencies. yes, some mistakes were made, we Are all humans. I got to tell you, when I see — I can only imagine how you feel, when I see Trump saying things like John Brennan is a lowlife — he called him a lowlife. Michael Hayden, clapper. I’ve had some of these guys on the show, when I see these guys, I do not see people who are power-hungry. First of all, like you just said, you can do anything. If you guys were power-hungry, you would have taken over by now. And I wish you would have. [laughs] But the fact that this president, to save his own skin, is willing to throw under the bus, as collateral damage, our intelligence service, and call these — he said clapper, I guess they got to him, too. “Got to him.” Like he funny it up the intelligence, it looked like Trump lost the popular vote or some bullshit.

Malcolm: Who was of the got to them? Some mafia boss? Russian mafia boss who was a former director of the KGB? Sorry, that’s Vladimir Putin, right? But these guys — these people are heroes.

Bill: I agree.

Malcolm: I know Mike Hayden, I know John Brennan, I have met them both. They would walk by the statue of Nathan Hale, the first spy to die for this nation, day in and day out, thankless — you wouldn’t believe the people. This audience is a pretty good cross-section of the average person that works at NSA or CIA or DIA, and they don’t want recognition. I didn’t want recognition until I got pulled into media. We just want to keep you safe, and Donald Trump does not fundamentally believe that that is what those people are there for.

Bill: He is what is important to him. when he attacks the deep state, I always think, the deep state, first of all, you know, “Time” magazine has made of the year, even though it is sometimes a computer or a group of people, you know, we are we still using that term, the deep state should be the man of the year. My question to you is, how deep? How deep is your state? I really need to know —

[Malcolm laughs]

Bill: Because we are living in a land of fools.

Malcolm: No, there is no such thing as deep state. Deep state is the janitor —

Bill: It’s the government.

Malcolm: It’s the janitor at GSA that is there polishing the floors at night. It’s the person who makes social security checks arrive on time.

Bill: Yes, but it’s also Hayden and clapper and Brennan. That’s the deep state. It’s the people — And James Comey. And McCabe and all of these people who are still there. He is still having to fight the deep state. My question is, when he fires a lot of these — he’s fired a lot of them already. How deep is it? How long before we don’t have —

Malcolm: No, it’s deep. It’s deep. I mean — What are you going to do? You start going down to the third tier analyst and —

Bill: Yes, that is exactly what he’s going to do. They are already talking about impeaching Rod Rosenstein, Right? Okay, who gets the report? The Mueller’s report? It’s the person in the job, the deputy attorney general. So if he has a reliable collaborator, when he gets that report from Mueller he can throw it in the garbage.

Malcolm: No. First off, that stuff is going into a classified vault, it’s got to go through about 20 people to get there. That stuff is going to fall off a truck by a pallet load in front of “The New York Times.”

[cheers and applause]

Bill: That’s true too. So you are on my page. We are not overreacting to Russia. We are actually under reacting to it I think?

Malcolm: We are. You ever hear that song in the musical “Hamilton” where George Washington rides in and everybody thinks he’s a savior and the first words out of his mouth as “we are outgunned, outmanned, outnumbered,  outplanned, we got to make an all-out stand.” That’s where we are. We are under attack. And this election that’s coming up, this could be the last one, as we know it, if we lose it.

Bill: what do you think the meeting that Putin and Trump had, two core hours there together? just talk to me, like, okay — no audience, we are just having a couple of brews. what did they really say to each Other? What did Putin want, what did Trump want? Are they as overt as “thanks so much for bringing the last Election. You know, we got another one coming up.” I promise, I’ll get the sanctions lifted. It is at that naked?

Malcolm: I wouldn’t be so sure it was so naked. I think they’ve already got that plan hashed out. I think — look, Trump in 2012 — sorry, 2013, he went to miss universe, met with the top 12 oligarchs in Russia in secret, just like this. He went in there a blank slate, when he walked out, he was pouting, to this day, the Kremlin party line, the elimination of NATO, the breakup of the European union, getting America out of its all of its treaty obligations, the elevation of Vladimir Putin. that could only have been put into his head by men who were so rich that he is jealous of their riches. So whatever they said in that meeting — — [applause] I will tell you what I told Chris Matthews the other day on “Hardball.” I think what happened there was a secret Yalta, which was the meeting in the 1940s between Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin, where they divided up the western world as it was going to look at the end of World War II. I think that that meeting heralded the realignment of the Western World.

Bill: and what is it?

Malcolm: The first thing is, you Destroy the Atlantic alliance. Breaking up of the United States, NATO, and the European capitals, and you re-angulate to a pole between an autocratic Washington and an autocratic Moscow meeting and axis of other European autocracies after you knock down their governments. And Trump did that. He called for, when he was sitting at Theresa May’s table, he called for regime change in Britain!

Bill: This is his plan, to do it in the open, right?


Bill: I know guys who used to cheat on their wife like this. They would be the most popular restaurant — “honey, if I was cheating, what I be sitting here With my hand on her ass ass.” That is his method. He does it right and open. People can’t believe. I mean the tweet this week about sessions should close down the Investigation. The admission to Lester Holt. It’s all out in the open!

Malcolm: Yeah, but he is doing it, he’s only speaking to 30% of the population of the United States.

Bill: But we can see him. We can hear him. I don’t know if you know is that we can hear him. All right.

Malcolm: He doesn’t care.

Bill: I got to go. You are a great patriot. thank you for doing what you did And what you keep doing. Thank you, malcom nance. Get his book. Thank you, let’s meet our panel.

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♪ ♪ [cheers and applause]

Bill: Crazy stuff. Okay! All right, here is our panel. he’s the ex-gop political strategist and co-host with Elise Jordan of the new podcast “Words Matter” premiering Monday, August 6th, Steve Schmidt is over here! Steve Schmidt! [cheers and applause] She’s a columnist for “The Washington Examiner” and political contributor for ABC News, Kristen Soltis Anderson back with us. And he’s a columnist for “The New York Times” and author of “Fire Shut Up in My Bones: A Memoir,” Charles Blow. Hey, Charles. Good to see you. Don’t forget to send us your questions for tonight’s “overtime” so we can answer them after the show on YouTube.
I didn’t get to Facebook, really, with Malcolm, so let me ask you that question. Facebook — I never understood Facebook. I think it’s the worst thing to happen to this country since high fructose corn syrup. Thank you very much. But plainly, that is a way that they are screwing with our elections. Should Facebook face bigger fines, penalties, something from the government?

Charles: If they can’t fix it, they absolutely should. We owed to them no sympathy, right?

Bill: How long will we give them to fix it?

Charles: I just want to say this. They’ve made boatloads of money, zillions of dollars, if you can make a sweater, show me the exact sweater I work, so my information to every advertiser that wants it, you can do anything, you can examine your platform and figure out who has access, who is manipulating it, who are — what third parties are you letting have access to it, you can do that. The reason that Facebook is not doing that is that they want to make it as easy as possible for the most people to be on that platform and the only way to make it safe is to make it a little bit harder for some people to be there. to have a better gatekeeper on that site. to make a few less zillion dollars.

Kristen: I just agree that there needs to be fines, fines for what? Facebook stock price drop to the last week or two. The biggest one-day loss in the history of the U.S. stock market.

Bill: Zuckerberg driving an Uber now?

Kristen: Because of the pressure being put on the platform by all of these stories. I mean, Facebook, the reason why Facebook was able to defeat their competitors in the early days of social media because the promise of Facebook, the people you are interacting with, and they were really who they said you they were. do not have a name and a real Identity. Facebook should be expected by their users to live up to that Promise. I don’t believe we should be expecting Mark Zuckerberg to become the FBI and the CIA. I think you want to Silicon Valley billionaires to be in charge of that?

Bill: We all know that you need an I.D. to buy groceries. why not I.D. to get onto Facebook? Would that be so hard? wouldn’t that stop the Russian bots?

Kristen: How would you even begin enforcing that? what type of I.D. to get onto Facebook for a global platform that serves people across the planet?

Bill: something that tells You who you are.

Kristen: It’s because they already expect that you are who you are. they are trying to sift out — because if they don’t, people will leave the platform. Their stock will keep dropping by the market is pressuring them to do the right thing.

Bill: can I read what dan Coats said? “we are doing every thing we can To have legitimate election.” [laughs] that is such a — what an encouraging statement. let me read it again just so you Feel good over the weekend. “we are doing everything we have Do have a legitimate election.” so I feel like we are becoming one of these countries, you know, every week, one of these countries are the leader appoints his kids, one of these countries, military parades, and it’s not that he hasn’t attacked The media before. but we didn’t take it a little personally, right, when it gets to this nasty level? He called today I think the media “horrendous, horrible people, disgusting enemy of the people.” We are all in the media. You are a pollster. You are supposed to be dispassionate. But we can be passionate about this, right?

Charles: I think every American needs to be passionate about this. free press was enshrined in the constitution and it predates the Constitution. it is one of the things that makes America different, that makes America special, and that makes America great. [cheers and applause] when we have people like the president with the power of the presidency trying to whittle away at that, to attack not only the truth sayers, but the truth seekers, including the investigators, anybody seeking the truth he attacks. Once you are removed from truth, anything can spout into that desert.

Bill: Yes, if you only believe Trump and Facebook, that is your choice.

Kristen: Being a journalist is already a very dangerous job. There was the slaughter of journalists in Annapolis, that was not because of Trump, if it was because of a crazy guy who didn’t like that they had done an expose on him. My point being, being a journalist is already really dangerous, so what it bothers me about this conversation about Trump saying mean things about the media, is sometimes —

Bill: Meaning?

Kristen: — and most journal — Look, I don’t like —

Bill: Wait a minute — Com’on, enemy of the people is not mean. We are way past mean.

Kristen: Most journalists are trying to do the right thing but there are a handful that have gotten into this pro wrestling thing, where they — when Trump says mean things at the rally, they say, well how dare he say that, and then he takes selfies with other people within Make America Great Again. It is like pro wrestling. It is not good.

Steve: This isn’t a question about media bias. What we are seeing is five things. We are seeing somebody go to mass rallies, constantly lie to inside fervor and a cult of personality base, we are seeing him make victimization honorable. They are all victims. We are seeing the allegation of conspiracy, the deep state, hidden, nefarious movements that only the leader can see. we see the scapegoating of minority populations, vulnerable populations, and lastly, the assertion that I need to exercise these powers that no president has ever claimed to have. This is deliberate. this is an assault on objective Truth. Once you get people to surrender their sovereignty, what is true is what the leader says is true, what is true is what the leader believes is true, even though what is true is staring you in the face, when that happens, you are no longer living in a Democratic republic. 35% of this country has checked out. They have joined a cult. They are obedient. They are obedient to the leader. And this is straight out of “1984,” with Winston at the end of the book, when the party official is holding up her four fingers, and Winston says in tears I see only four, and the leader of the party says it could be three or five, it is what the party tells you, and that is when democracy dies in America.

[cheers and applause]

Kristen: It scares me but it did not begin with Trump.

Bill: come on, it’s on a level —

Kristen: Ten years ago, Sarah Palin walks out on stage at the republican convention in Minneapolis, and she ignites a piece of the republican base, and then attacks the lame stream Media. In 2012, Newt Gingrich rises in the polls in the South Carolina primary by attacking the media on stage. this is not something that began with Trump. this youth had been planted within the republican party.

Bill: Seeds are not trees.

Charles: That’s the thing. You bark and condemning the republican party, which should be condemned, because forever, they knew that these people were in that party, they knew that they were benefiting from this element of their party, and they turned a blind eye to it. They said, I believe that we can control this, we believe that we can bring them over to moderation! We believe that we can keep these people, only have them come out on election day. What you found out was that you cannot contain that monster. Donald Trump has unleashed your monster that you always knew was there and has turned on you, and now, mainstream republicans are now saying, oh, my god, my party is gone — No, that was the party you are bating and feeding the whole time. [cheers and applause]

Bill: It is different. I know — I want to show this. I saw this congressman, Stephen Lynch, never heard of them, but I saw them on TV, and I wanna show you a little bit of what he said a couple of weeks ago.

Stephen Lynch: Are you kidding me? This is where we are at now? This is a disgrace! Disgrace! that was a national embarrassment in Helsinki. I was embarrassed! that our president was fighting against our intelligence agencies. It’s time to decide what you stand for! Do you stand for democracy? Or do you stand with that gangster in Moscow?

[cheers and applause]

Bill: I am showing that because I feel, first of all, It’s very genuine. It’s not a trumped up speech. He really was feeling better. and I feel like this, the Democrats are not doing this. when I redo, just heard you, you do it, you do it, you don’t have to do it, you are a Pollster. We don’t expect it from you. but I hear moral outrage from you. I read it in you, and appropriate level of fire. It’s not about just screaming. but I think the people in this country do not understand the level of the crisis we are at! And to a degree, this has to take place. this kind of talk, this kind of rhetoric, because I don’t think otherwise they are going to get it.

Steve: Democracy is in regression All over the world. in Poland, Hungary, Austria, Italy, we see the rise of autocrats and autocracies and to see an american president cheerleading at is as scandalous as it is disturbing, but the assaults on the rule of law, the lawlessness of this president, the attacks in our institutions, this may all be much more fragile and it certainly is more fragile I think that I thought it was, but the truth of the matter is this, when we look back at history to the 1930s, fascism did not rise because it was a strong, but rather because democracy was impotent and weak. And when you have a country now whre 80% of people born in the 1930s thinks it’s essential to live in a democracy, you ask the same question to people born in the 80s, the number is 25%. That is a profound crisis and America, America is under attack by the Russian Federation that is trying to eradicate trust, faith, and belief in the American republic and our democratic institutions, and our political leadership and the majority party is complicit in it. If they are defending this country, and they are unfaithful to their oath of office and to the constitution of the United States. [cheers and applause]

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Bill: this week, something happened, Jeff Sessions announced a religious liberty Tax force. are there religious people here Tonight? well, you will be insulted by This. [laughs] because, you know, they have this martyr complex, the questions, I’m sorry, they do, just because I’m sure of you Know who. and so they feel like even though they are 69% of the population, they are somehow under attack, so they have created this religious liberty task force, including this magazine, “Religious Liberty Weekly.” would you like to see some articles and here?

“Mike Pence: sexiest man alive.”
“5 ways to tell your megachurch pastor is gay. Hint: he’s the pastor of a megachurch.”
“12 abstinence tricks that will leave him begging for less.”
“Dinner conversation: how to argue with your family members that “read.”
“We investigate: if God’s all powerful, why can’t Kirk Cameron find work?”
“Interview: Donald Trump on the two commandments and why the other eight are for losers.”
“Hand-holding: does it lead to dancing?”
“Hot new ways to judge others! That won’t break your collection plate.”
“10 Days to a tighter ass. “one position that will drive him wild.”
“Social media bombshell: pic of light shining through clouds not mandatory on christian profiles.”

Wow, there is a lot of fucking religious people here.

“Recognizing the signs of oral sex. It may be going on right under your nose.”
“threat in the sky: are rainbows gay air?”

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Okay, let’s bring out Nancy. She is history professor at Duke University and author of “Democracy in Chains: The Deep History of the Radical Right’s Stealth Plan for America,” Nancy MacLean.

[cheers and applause] ♪ ♪

Bill: How are you? Great to meet you. you can bring that home with you. We’ve been going on and on about the trouble the country is in but you have written a whole book about it, and I think you would agree with some of our panelists here that it’s been going on longer than Trump, right?

Nancy: Yes, I would say thank you and I meant it too.

Bill: this viewed that he was sort of having with the Koch brothers, I know you’ve written a lot about the Koch brothers, this is really funny, isn’t It? they are basically on the same page, what’d you say?

Nancy: Yes. It’s a tremendous distraction. I have been studying Charles Koch on the plan that he has been developing in the plans that they have organized for over a decade now, and I have learned one thing, which is never pay attention to any individual play, and instead look at the long game that he is Playing. once you understand that elongate menu understand the strategy, you can get a better sense of what the pieces are And what went to Spain. case in point is this: suddenly we are seeing signs of life between them, all the other things I did nothing to upset Charles Koch, all the horrors we have seen a different places, nothing would have it about the Border, et cetera, why now? Minor? because they are this close to getting Brett Kavanaugh, a Koch selected supreme court justice on the court, just in time to affect what Koch is actually seeking, which is, in the language of the architect whose ideas he is weaponized, who I studied in my book, James Buchanan, the first U.S. southerner to win the Nobel prize in U.S. Sciences, changes in our constitution so radical as to be called a constitutional revolution. They want to transform our constitution in a radical and fundamental way and we are all being distracted by the president’s tweets while this is going on.

Bill: that is so crazy. because the people who need the constitution changed are the liberals. we are the ones it’s not working for.

Nancy: So true.

Bill: you mentioned the Supreme court. the supreme court should be 7-two liberal because four of the justices were appointed by — two by Bush, triggered by Trump. Two president who lost the popular vote. That is what I mean. the electoral college works for them. So what do they want? that they are not getting now?

Nancy: Yeah, actually have a little history listen, a civics lesson toward the end of the book where I point out that our constitution is already the most restrictive of majoritarian democracies in the world. We have what are called four veto– what’s called veto points. We have four, most people have one, maybe two, three, we have four. So these guys are essentially so greedy that they want to add more veto points to what we have.

Bill: what is a veto point? What do you mean?

Nancy: Things like the electoral College, right? the capacity of the senate to Veto. but what they want to actually put into effect is instead of a constitution of checks and balances, as we have now, a Constitution of locks and bolts. and while we are distracted by Donald Trump’s tweets, the network that Charles Koch’s funding, groups like the american legislative exchange council have been lining up authorizations for constitutional convention, they now have 28 of the 34 authorizations needed to call the first ever article 5 constitutional convention since our constitution was crafted. they have ten liberty amendments, they call them, teed up and ready to go. and we haven’t been paying any attention at all, with the exception of groups like common cause.

Bill: what are the ten — what is, like, the top two horrible ones?

Nancy: This is also an example of how folks in our site could be a little bit more curious and stop thinking that we know everything and actually read the other side’s stuff and pay attention —

Bill: You were right.

Nancy: There is a book that was a best seller on the right that none of us have heard of called “The Liberty Amendments” that Goes into it. You can Google them. they include a balanced budget amendment, which pulls well when people understand it would mean the end of social security, medicare, all the other things We value. they also include putting voter I.d. In the u.s. Constitution. and they are so radical that they actually include revoking The 17th amendment. nobody’s going to remember what the 17th amendment is, so I will tell you real quick: it was a progressive era victory that led to the people directly elect our u.s. Senators instead of having them selected by state Governments.

Bill: Senators used to be Appointed.

Nancy: Exactly. the state government is easiest for corporations to capture and the Koch network know knows this, and they control 30 states, and they are essentially putting a choke hold around progressive policy nationally and at the local level, Something called preemption.

Bill: was into this. according to the Weldon Cooper center, by 2040, that is only, like, 20 years away, eight states will have half the population, and 16, if you add another eight states, will have 70%. The 16 most populous states will have 70% of the population, 30% of the population will control 68% of the senate seats, of course, because California with 40 million people gets two senators and so does Wyoming with two people. So it looks like we are becoming this country where I feel like it is Iraq under Saddam and the liberals — [laughs] Go with me. Right? the Sunnis where there minority, but they ran the country. they were one-third of the country but they were in power, and two-thirds of the country was the shiites and they had no power, and we are going to be two-thirds of the country, the liberals, but we are not going to have any power, because of the axis of evil of Donald Trump, Rupert Murdoch, and Charles Koch.

Nancy: if I may say, they are actually —


Bill: what do we do then?

Nancy: they are quite aware that They are minority. I quote Charles Koch in the book when he says in 1987, really launching this effort in earnest, he says, “since we are greatly outnumbered, the failure to use our superior technology Ensures failure.” meeting they know they are a permanent minority, repeated historical experience shows that left the majority of the american people would never sign up for the america they are trying to bring them to a “no” social security, no medicare, no antidiscrimination legislation, no production of air and water, so, how will they Get around that? To get what they want? stealth, doing things like voter suppression, using the method voter fraud, gerrymandering, destroying labor unions, and planned parenthood, sources of collective —

Bill: You are right, we don’t pay attention. You know why?

Nancy: We are so distracteble.

Bill: Facebook. Exactly! it is all the people at Facebook. It’s true. People don’t read. They think Facebook is reading. It’s not. Okay, so let me ask this political Question. Trump is endorsing a lot of these Trump candidates and they are running. he was talking about —

In in the primaries.

Bill: shouldn’t we be rooting for this? I think this is a good thing. I think what has to happen in the fall is that other republicans have to see that Trump candidates lose. of course they’re going to enact the primary but that is the only way to break the stranglehold on the republican politician, no?

Steve: If you look at a special election, you are sitting there is a house campaign strategist, you are saying that, unless you are in a district that is plus 25% drop or greater, you could Be in trouble. you could be in a plus 20% Trump district then you could go down Into as an 18. so I think there is going to be An enormous blue tsunami. I think the republicans will Lose control of the house. but what will be left behind Will not be chastened. it will be more batch it should crazy because what is left behind is going to be people in plus 25, plus 30% Trump districts, and their only vulnerability, in a country now are the politicians pick their voters, not the other way around, their only vulnerability is to be out crazied in the next primary 112% turnout occurs and only, obviously, the craziest people turn out to, and that is —

I don’t mind if they are batshit crazy as long as they Are in their minority. As long as they don’t win. be crazy, just be in the minority. what we have now is a congress that refuses to play its role as a check and balance and the President. That cannot exist. [applause]

Kristen: I have perspective on the political side, it depends on it has raised now, the vast majority of democratic ads are Not focused on fighting Trump. they are focused on the issue of Health care. on the public inside, more of these house folks are running as Donald Trump. the senate is a very different picture because you have a lot of democrats and states that Trump won. so in that case, Trump plays a very different role than he does in — right now, democrats need to pick up 24 seats. 23 seats are republican held, in districts that Hillary Clinton won. There, if you are one of those folks, you would may be rather not Donald Trump come to Your district. if you are a democrat and a red state, and, and all of a sudden, Trump shows up and says, get this democrat out of here because they are obstructing my agenda, that can complicate Things. So it just depends on the geography and what race you are talking About.

Nancy: So I’m a historian. I feel slight discomfort because the conversation is so focused On the near term. my first book was about the Ku Klux Klan of the 1920s when It was the biggest right. Organization we’ve experienced. This 25% can do enormous damage. I think we all understand that. the norms of our society, the way government operates, we are already seeing the impact on the lives of even children of color in elementary schools, from what The right has unleashed. so I think it is really important that we not just focus on the next elections cycle or the one after that, but instead, start thinking about how we will break that up, how we will reach the people who have been so deceived and so agitated, had their buttons pushed by this right, — I know because I got another mailing list, I know this are they sent out, it is ugly. And they keep them in a state of high alert, and I feel we get into a situation where we are just yelling and they are just yelling, we are no gonna break up this impasse that we are in we gonna have to be a lot more strategic.

Charles: I hear that argument a lot. I’m very curious about it. where my supposed to meet a bigot in the middle? How does that work?

Nancy: yeah. I’m so glad you asked that. That isn’t what I’m suggesting. I’m suggesting thinking about bringing into the conversation other things, like the state of social security, public schools, the red state teachers Mobilization. there are people who are angry, they understand our society is coming apart, they have a vision of what to do with that. on the particular question that you raise, the organization, great organization, they have done focus groups on this issue, and they have poll tested these things that circulate among liberals, saying, with a poll tested two messages. one is a pure economic message or two white voters that ignores all that Trump is doing and ignores the toxic environment. the second one says to people directly, these people are trying to turn us against one another. trying to leverage hostility against African-Americans and against immigrants and against people who are lesbian and gay or, in order to get their agenda. If you approach people honestly, give them a message that is wrong —

Charles: You’re talking about white people?

Nancy: You are right. you just that, how can I talk to Bigots?

Charles: It’s a very serious thing. because this whole conversation after 2016 was about how do we make white people feel less anxious and afraid, more Comfortable? is about a very curious thing to tell the rest of us who all live our lives feeling afraid, uncomfortable, anxious, that we don’t have to make white people feel good? [applause]

Bill: excuse me but in a week where we found out a lot of the people on the right believe in QAnon, that they believe that there is this giant cabal of child molesters running the world, when the people say, “it doesn’t help to say they are stupid”… but you think Tom Hanks is a pedophile? again, just like — I don’t know How to meet in the middle there. I don’t know how to — I’m not making the case to Meet in the middle.

Steve: You can go back to the history come all the way to the beginning, 25% of this country has always been wack jobs. Always! I mean, going back, the pension for conspiracy, the know nothing movement that throws the marble that the catholic Pope donated for the Washington monument into the Potomac river, it has always Been there. the point is, there are more of Us than there are of them. and in an election, that is secure, you hope that that manifests itself. but fear is a contagion in a democracy. Trump uses fear and he is exhausting the opposition. when you were in a fight, you can win two ways: you can bring your opponent to submission, think Germany and Japan after World War II, or you can break their will to fight. Think of the United States in Vietnam. the degree to which Trump and his allies and the constancy of the craziness, it breaks people’s wills. I checked them out. They become exhausted by it. I think there is some evidence in the polling to see that’s happening, so 95 days from an election, which I would argue is the most important midterm election of the history of the United States of America.

Bill: I agree. [cheers and applause]

Steve: Everybody out there — everybody out there has a job to do. It’s devoted make sure your friends fall because there must be a check on this lawless administration where we are down the road 10 miles into Trumpistan looking at the United States of America in the rearview mirror.

Bill: Great way to end it. Thank you, panel.

* * *

Time for “new rules,” everybody. [cheers and applause] ♪ ♪

new rule: the guards who caught this Texas woman trying to smuggle meth into prison have to tell me: what tipped you off? And she has to tell me why, out of 28 million Texans, you’re the only one not wearing a trucker hat. That was also a forward rough. I agree.

new rule: police must admit that stealing a shark from an aquarium by wrapping it in a blanket, placing it in a stroller, and disguising it as a baby was a brilliant plan. Because nobody ever says anything when they see a really ugly baby. [applause]

new rule: fat guys have to settle on a strategy for suits. Alex Jones says go four sizes too small, so you look like an ugly kid who had a summer growth spurt. But Trump says, “no, wear them six sizes too big, like it’s a tent and the circus is your ass.” [applause] Wait a second. His jacket’s too small… Yours is too big… Did you guys hook up?

new rule: the Scottish ice cream parlor that sells mayonnaise-flavored ice cream has to apologize to the rest of Scotland. You invented a food that’s shitty even for Scotland. [applause] that’s like making a porno that’s too twisted for Japan.

new rule: someone must tell the pride of lions that stalked and ate three rhinoceros poachers in a south African game reserve, “next time save some room for dessert.” [cheers and applause]

and finally, new rule: the party of Reagan has to explain how it’s become the party of Putin. while “Real Time” was on our break last month, the infamous pee tape was finally found: it’s a high definition video of a press conference in Helsinki, and it’s irrefutable evidence of a Russian ho. And his name is Donald Trump. [applause] and like most hos, he always sounds terrified when he’s with his pimp.

President Putin was extremely strong and powerful in his denial today and what he did is an incredible offer. He just said it’s not Russia. I will say this, I don’t see any Reason why it would be.

Bill: Yeah, this is like after 9/11, if Bush stood on the rubble at the World Trade Center and shouted into the bullhorn, “Bin Laden is innocent and the FBI will hear from all of us soon!” Yes, the president of the United States is a traitor, but being Trump, a man who’s never been faithful to anything but himself, that’s not such a surprise. But how did Russia flip an entire political party? And not the one that was supposedly saw fun Russia? 87% of republicans say that Trump should invite the dictator that keeps attacking us to the White House to stay probably. And Melania says “he can have my room”. Of course, part of this is due to the republican party now being a straight up cult. Trump can claim that when he said “would,” he meant to say “wouldn’t,” and because every day is opposite day now, the rest of the party says, “makes perfect un-sense to me.” Would is wouldn’t now, and being friends with Russian thugs is, repeat after me, “good, not bad.”

Donald Trump: That’s a good thing, not a bad thing. Good thing, not a bad thing. It’s a good thing, not a bad Thing. That’s a good thing, not a bad thing.

Bill: Good, not bad. Good, not bad. [cheers and applause] So that’s part of the answer. but for such a fundamental shift for an entire party, there has to be something more going on here, and I think there is. I think the dirty little secret about the republicans and their newfound love for baseball, apple pie, and mother Russia is that it’s about race. [applause] Last year, Ann Coulter tweeted, “in 20 years, Russia will be the only country that is recognizably European.” As far back as 2013, Matt Drudge called Putin “the leader of the free world.” David Duke described Russia as “The key to white survival.” Today’s republicans, what’s left of them, do not like the melting pot, and Russia? That pot don’t melt. Russia is one of the last places on earth to say, “fuck diversity, we’re here, we’re white, get used to it.”

I remember going to London in the ’80s, and everyone was white. The closest thing to an Afro was these guys [he shows a photo of the Queen’s Guard]. Now London looks like New York and the mayor is brown. And the princess is even half black! [cheers and applause] In the recent world cup, the French national team didn’t look like the old France, it looked like the new France. Germany let in a million Syrians. The fatherland is now the brotherland. You know how many Syrian refugees Russia has taken in? Two. Martin Sheen has more refugees in his pool house. This is what the Russian army looks like, the ballet, their basketball team looks like the team that plays against the Globetrotters. They have a drink called a white Russian that’s actually the whitest drink there is: let’s see, I want to get drunk, but I also want a glass of milk. Russia is a honky oasis, and Republicans love it. Russian kids don’t learn the words to “despacito,” and a Barack Obama does not become the President of Russia. Wingnuts accused Obama of being a foreign agent who took over America, but when a foreign power actually did take over America, and it was the proudly white one, their response was, “Come right in. To the members of the grand old party, Russian meddling in our elections isn’t a breach of national security; it’s white people helping white people. what republicans call “governing.”

All right, that’s our show. I’ll be at the Oakdale theater in New Haven, Connecticut, august 12th. at the fox theatre in st. Louis, august 25th, and at the Kansas city music hall in Kansas city, august 26th. I want to thank my guests, Anderson, Charles Blow, Nancy MacLean, and Malcolm Nance. Join us now for “overtime” on Youtube. Thank you, folks! [cheers and applause] ♪ ♪ [Cheers and applause] ♪ ♪


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